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Unhappy UK Phono Stage Owner

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baelfire View Drop Down
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    Posted: 15 Apr 2019 at 6:40pm
Hehe, now that I got your attention everybody I want to share my story.

Last year I was looking for a pre-amp to upgrade my system. Since I was working with my Audio Technica LP5's internal pre-amp, I thought any preamp would be a significant upgrade.

I made the "mistake" to borrow (through the excellent Graham Slee Forum and the more than excellent Suggs) an Era Gold preamp.

It arrived, I plugged it in and.... nothing happened. Only... wait...

Songs started making sense! My modest turntable started singing. Once I sat across my speakers and listened to the entire "Animals" LP by Pink Floyd. The entire album. Speachless. I said it must be something else. I unplugged the preamp and switched back to the internal one. Oh god no, the sound "hurt".

I kept (as I must shamefully admit) the preamp for more than 15 days. It was that great. Finally I returned it reluctantly. Now I was facing a very different problem. I had to find a preamp that sounded as natural, as liquid, as GOOD as this one. 

I tried a friend's phono (a Rega Aria or something) and it sounded like mud.

Finally I decided that GSP was too expensive for me and I'd go with a more affortable model. 

So I picked a Tisbury Audio Domino. UK made? Check! Aluminium body? Check! I even made a spreadsheet to compare the 3-4 models I had in mind.

And it came, I connected it and.... Ok it sounds naturally better than the LP5's internal preamp but still. It's not even 20% of the enjoyment I had with the Slee. I mean, I am no audiophile by any means. I buy records and I do care about the pressing okay , I can understand when a digital recording is transfered to vinyl and I hate that but I don't fancy myself as an audiophile. 

I like my music, I love my records and since last year I spent tons of money on them. But today I admited it to myself: I can't go on thinking that my preamp is as good as the Era Gold. It's not. It is as simple as that. I now have to sell (probably at a loss) my Tisbury and then look to buy the one my ears told me was the one from the beginning. Maybe I couldn't believe that such a tiny machine can have such a difference in a system or that the price difference was too big to justify this move. After all the turntable cost less. Then. Now it has a Shibata stylus so I guess my system has "matured". 

Now tell me am I going to be alright? Smile

I'd really appreciate any comments or suggestions!

Take care people,
Kostas


Edited by baelfire - 15 Apr 2019 at 6:44pm
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patientot View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patientot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Apr 2019 at 7:39pm
My only suggestion is to save your money for something you know is good. I've been down that path too, buying something that wasn't really what I wanted due to needing instant gratification and having a tight budget in the first place. Sometimes it satisfies you for awhile and other times it just backfires. 

RE: your turntable, the built-in preamps are a well known issue on some of the similar models. I am not sure if the circuit on your particular model is a true bypass one or if the sound still goes through the circuitry in a way that mucks it up. You might ask AT customer support about that. If they say the built-in phono circuit is NOT true bypass then you may want to remove or bypass the internal phono. There are various videos and instructions for how to do this online. Obviously it would void the warranty so that is something to consider. But if your warranty is already up or almost up then maybe you don't care. 

RE: the price difference between the turntable and the phono preamp, I wouldn't worry about it. There is no "rule" that says the retail price between all of your components needs to be equal. For me personally, the cartridge and the phono preamp are the heart of the vinyl playback system, so those merit spending a bit more on. I've spent far more on those items combined than I spent on my turntable, though I should say I'm running a vintage deck and got it for a good price. 


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baelfire View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote baelfire Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Apr 2019 at 8:18pm
Thank you for taking the time to reply!

Before buying my turntable I read a lot of articles regarding the AT turntables.

The LP120 is the one that has to be "operated" to get rid of the preamp circuit.

The one I got is the LP5 which is (was) the top of the line model. They state that this has a redesigned motor (which it has) and a redesigned circuitry. I went all out with this buy and I didn't regret it. I was almost 200% over my starting budget.

I read some rave reviews on my turntable especially from people who combine it with a higher end preams and cartridges. I tried the same approach with the preamp and it failed me. Well I don't know, failed may be a strong word, the little Domino is not that bad but it surely isn't a Graham Slee!

I will continue the "journey" and consider buying an Era Gold in the future (if Graham still produce it for a couple of years!). Or maybe they are already producing a better one?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patientot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Apr 2019 at 8:24pm
My understanding is that the ERA Gold V was "replaced" by the Reflex, but people still wanted the ERA due to reviews and reputation so it stays in production. The TOTL MM preamp in the line is the Accession M. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cyreg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Apr 2019 at 10:23pm
Hi Kostas, you could start out relatively cheap with a GramAmp 2 Communicator with green PS
 
Than later on the possibility to upgrade with a PSU1
Sounds a little out of the ordinary, but GA2C/PSU1 is a very good phonoamp solution 
And I do use that setup myself with my Michell TecnoDec/RB250/Nagaoka MP110
 
So maybe try another loan than or... just buy the least expensive GrahamSlee phonoamp ;-)
Good luck!!
TecnoDec/RB250/MP110>GramAmp2C/PSU1; Cyrus CD8SE; > Exposure 3010S2D INT > Harbeth C7ES-3 '35th Anniversary'
cabling: IC 2x DNM V3; LScable Exposure DMF-two; Furu TP60 + MWaY and BlackCable pc's
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patientot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Apr 2019 at 10:29pm
Originally posted by Cyreg Cyreg wrote:

Hi Kostas, you could start out relatively cheap with a GramAmp 2 Communicator with green PS
 
Than later on the possibility to upgrade with a PSU1
Sounds a little out of the ordinary, but GA2C/PSU1 is a very good phonoamp solution 
And I do use that setup myself with my Michell TecnoDec/RB250/Nagaoka MP110
 
So maybe try another loan than or... just buy the least expensive GrahamSlee phonoamp ;-)
Good luck!!


Another idea to try is the used market for GS. You might find a used model at a price that's doable then save for whatever higher end model you want down the line. I sometimes see the less expensive models for sale after people do an upgrade. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Suggs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2019 at 7:08am
Originally posted by Cyreg Cyreg wrote:


So maybe try another loan than or... just buy the least expensive GrahamSlee phonoamp


I think a loan of a "lower" model in the range may well find the solution for you. It would be good to buy something from the GSP range that you can afford now, so at least you can enjoy your music more, then upgrade if and when funds allow. I'd go with Cyreg's recommendation of the Gramamp2 SE as a good starting point for you.

PS Thanks for the compliment in your original post!
Derek
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