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Minimising surface noise of vinyl on recordings?

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Martyk View Drop Down
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    Posted: 14 Apr 2021 at 6:43am
First of all my setup:

Turntable: Technics 1210GR
Stylus: Audio Technica VM750SH (Aligned and adjusted properly)
Preamp: Graham Slee Accession MM
Interface: Focusrite Scarlett 2i2
Machine for recording: Laptop (Used on battery)
Cables: RCA (Bluejeans) from Turntable to Preamp.
RCA>1/4 (HOSA) Phono to Focusrite
USB from Focusrite to Laptop.
Audacity for recording

Finally got my ground noise sorted out thanks to the help of everyone on various forums. Ended up getting an isolation transformer for use of just the turntable which fixed my ground loop noise.

However I now face (and always have done) the white noise of when the volume is cranked up.
The surface noise on quiet parts of the song is very noticeable. If I compare this to other peoples recordings they seem to have a lot less surface noise than me.

I do a very thorough cleaning procedure where I use the mix of 20 IPA and 80 Distilled water with a few drops of Triton X. Sprayed on then using quite a bit of elbow grease i clean the records with a velvet brush and vacuum it off at the end with a microfibre lined wet and dry vac. Followed after that with record revirginizer.. so the vinyl condition is really good and don't believe its the record surfaces.

I don't like to do manual noise removal because i have found it really messes with the artefacts of the tracks. Particularly for a 2 step beat.

Power conditioners can be very pricey and its a hell of a lot of money to spend on something which i don't know will sort my problem out.

Just wondered if you know of any decent hardware I can use to filter out a lot of surface noise of the records and that white noise you would get when cranking the volume high?

Please have a listen to the sample. Between the beats at the beginning is particularly noticeable.

Warning this is probably not to most of your tastes!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Graham Slee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Apr 2021 at 9:25am
What noise?

I played it using Foobar2000 which tells me it's 48kHz 24 bit, and was playing out of my 192kHz 24 bit sound card via optical to my Majestic DAC with its 192kHz optical reception mod, and from there to my pair of Proprius, driving Harbeth M20 mini monitors.

I can't do rave levels or the neighbours might hear it, although my soundproofing is quite good. What I could hear was a considerable amount of detail which sounds like frantic samples of finger snapping on speed!

Played three times and I really tried to hear surface noise, but if you had not told me it was off vinyl, I would swear it wasn't vinyl.

Are you sure you uploaded the right track?

Not simple enough for Google-Bot to understand...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Martyk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Apr 2021 at 9:34am
Thats the result of your amazing Accession MM! There is such a difference between that and my ART Preamp. 

Unfortunately I have just realised that track was one i did software noise removal on using Izotope.

I will make another recording and not touch any of the noise after wards.

It sounds like you played it through some pretty hardcore kit and if it sounds good through that then that is really comforting to know and feel I probably have nothing to be concerned about. Especially if you think it came from CD which is what I am aiming to do... Make my rips sound as digital as possible!

Thanks Graham i iwll reply shortly with an untouched rip.




Edited by Martyk - 14 Apr 2021 at 9:35am
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CageyH View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CageyH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Apr 2021 at 12:10pm
Is the noise on every track, or only certain?
Record condition can play a part in surface noise.
Kevin
European loan coordinator, based near Toulouse, France.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patientot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Apr 2021 at 1:02pm
I won't listen to the sample just yet until we know it's the right one.

Re: surface noise in general, it can vary a lot from record to record IME. Not just due to condition and wear and tear which affects all used records, but due to how the record was made in the first place.

Here in the U.S., we had plenty of records made using too much regrind. Some labels and plants were famous for it. Plenty of plants just made noisy records no matter what also. Compare that to a record pressed on Quiex II or JVC Supervinyl and it's night and day.

If we're talking about club/dance music, I can tell you the records pressed over in France, Germany, etc. were much higher quality than some of the records made at a plant here in my hometown. Just the way it is. I still have some 12''s from the 90s here.

Re: cleaning I am not a fan of microfiber at all. Back when I experimented with DIY cleaners and homebrew fluids I used microfiber towels and all they did was shed fibers into the vinyl and then deposit them on the stylus. Often you couldn't see this while using them, or even right away, but fibers would wrap around the stylus over time and be very hard to remove. As a result, ALL microfiber is banned from touching my records.

What I might suggest you do is add a rinse cycle to your cleaning process with nothing but plain distilled water. I would also cut down on the elbow grease since that's not going to help if your fluid is any good. The fluid alone with mild agitation should dislodge debris on average dusty used records, which is why I use AI #15, which is an enzyme-based record cleaner. Most of the other fluids I've tried are too weak and don't clean well enough for my taste.

If these are records that were used heavily in a club DJ environment you might want to look into a bulk ultrasonic tank cleaning situation where you can clean multiple records at a time.


Reflex M + PSU-1 used with AT VM95ML, Stanton 680mkII + Ogura, and Shure M35X cartridges.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Martyk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Apr 2021 at 1:41pm
Thanks everyone for getting back

I was just about to make a fresh recording but when i peeled the record revirginizer off its left an awful mess over the record. I am pretty sure their solutions have deteriorated recently. If you're not familiar with it itsl ike a glue which cleans the records. Its very good but very expensive and have been a bit disappointed with the recent lot. The reason I am using record revirginizer instead of doing my previously mentioned way is just to get it that bit more clean. Wish i hadn't now though because its left all these strands on the record :(

I was very happy to see they sell that in Australia that you mentioned for 70 dollars a bottle. Tempted to get one! I will avoid Microfibre then. That may actually explain why i have been finding all these very small bits in the grooves.

I will get another rip uploaded tomorrow onto here as i need to go to bed now.

Will upload it shortly.

Thanks for your help :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Godra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2021 at 2:14am
Originally posted by patientot patientot wrote:



What I might suggest you do is add a rinse cycle to your cleaning process with nothing but plain distilled water []...

If these are records that were used heavily in a club DJ environment you might want to look into a bulk ultrasonic tank cleaning situation where you can clean multiple records at a time.



My experience concurs with Patientot. Adding a rinse cycle is fundamental to get less noisy record. Also, this way you won't end up with gunk on your stylus. The rinse cycle remove the cleaning agent. 

Last year, I bought myself a cheap ultrasonic tank and wasn't fully satisfied until I took seriously the rinse step. I also added a water filter with a small pump to keep the water clean in the tank. This way you can clean a lot of records.
Clearaudio Performance DC with Clarify tonearm + Virtuoso V2, Tannoy Legacy Eaton, Accession MM and BAT VK300Xse
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