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USB vs S/PDIF

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Ash View Drop Down
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    Posted: 16 Jun 2020 at 7:58pm
So is optical or coaxial really a higher fidelity interface than USB (with linear power supply, not bus power)? I mean by Slee design standards. I would be interested to read Graham's reasoning on this question. Is toslink/coax worth pursuing or is the grass not always greener? The purpose of digital audio is to be streamed to a receiver and USB seems to be the modern standard for transferring data between devices. Why aren't optical/coax used for devices like external hard drives? Is it just the convenience of USB having both power and signal in one cable rather than connecting two separate cables?

Surely there is a rationale why Graham only gave the Bitzie USB input...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BackinBlack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jun 2020 at 8:15pm
If I recall correctly, wasn't the Bitzie conceived as a "digital" version of the Voyager. If so, the typical input was to be USB from a mobile device, very few, if any, having S/PDIF outputs. The inclusion of S/PDIF would have also added to the physical size which is critical for a mobile device.

As to which is superior, USB or S/PDIF. I think it depends very much on the devices concerned. I shall remain on the fence.

Ian
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BackinBlack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jun 2020 at 8:20pm
Just listen, if it sounds good to you, enjoy it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Graham Slee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jun 2020 at 10:35pm
I think USB is more consistent between different host devices, but I only tried the Bitzie and Majestic as receivers.

I tried a number of S/PDIF sources into the Majestic, and all had a different sound, and I guess that's how it is. It can be transformer driven or resistively driven, coax or optical, and it might be level translated, and if so, could be one of a number of logic chips and/or gating arrangements, all with different propagation timing, and even ringing (or not) on the waveform. Even with the excellent features of the WM8804 transceiver doing the S/PDIF receiving, it has to lock onto the clock which might not be so well defined as it could.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jun 2020 at 10:58pm
Thank you.

I have always got great results out of Bitzie and Majestic from USB, especially Majestic into Proprius and earspeakers. Some USB ports exhibit more noise than others.

I guess, as usual, only a little can be learned by talking and the rest has to be found by doing and experiencing. Shall sell some stuff for funds then have a play with some more single board computers that are fanless and I can add a linear PSU. Looking at the HDPlex PSU as a possible candidate for future testing. Great thing about the Majestic is the number of inputs available, which can potentially be compared side-by-side at the turn of a dial.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 7:48am
With regards to my first post, a very important point that I missed is that data transfer can be bidirectional in USB whereas optical/coax are for unidirectional data transfer only, so not suitable for storage media where you need the facility to both send and recall.

Maybe isochronous USB, with its 'guaranteed timing', is the most reliable and consistent interface despite having a smaller sample rate bandwidth than S/PDIF options.


Edited by Ash - 17 Jun 2020 at 7:58am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Graham Slee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 8:23am
I'm no computer expert. All I know is isochronous USB audio is sent in "packets" consisting of ID and other clever preamble bits, a "snippet" of PCM audio, n-bits long, and an end-point. It seems to have "excess baggage." Somehow, the USB CODEC throws away the unwanted bits, leaving snatches of audio, which are shoved into a buffer, and emerge as a stream. In the case of data outputted, it is in S/PDIF form, but at logic levels.

The only thing "fed back" to the host is HID instructions such as volume control, which I "null." If the host sends a glitch, the glitch might screw the music around, or add noise, but I've not been able to hear it. Otherwise, it just keeps playing, and the "rules" are such that it does.

I once had a knackered PC, which while playing, stopped doing the other things I wanted it to do, and hung. It kept playing correctly until it blue-screened and shut down - for good.

Audiophiles say they prefer asynchronous because it handshakes, which is supposed to make it sound better because it's more accurate. But if it doesn't verify, it stops playing while it sorts it out.
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