Audio System Set-Up - PMC 22 with Sub

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PMC 22 with Sub

Printed From: Graham Slee Hifi System Components
Category: And the rest
Forum Name: Audio System Set-Up
Forum Description: Discussions about getting the best from your system (Digital section now moved)
URL: https://www.hifisystemcomponents.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5580
Printed Date: 20 Apr 2024 at 4:17pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com

Topic: PMC 22 with Sub

Posted By: RedRover7
Subject: PMC 22 with Sub
Date Posted: 23 Jan 2023 at 11:07pm

Hi All,

New member here looking for advice. I am using PCM 22 speakers in my set up in a medium room 4.5 x 4.0 meters.

Was wondering has anyone else the same speakers and used a sub to complement these other than the VERY expensive PMC matching sub. If so what was the brand and model ? I am thinking of BK or REL as options that may work. The PMC are super speakers in terms of clarity detail etc in my opinion.

Rest of system is SME 10A with Dynavector 10 x 5 cart, GS Gram

AMP 2 SE and Arcam A39. Also think of Accession upgrade and wondering what type of improvements I can expect over the exceptional Gram 2 SE ?

Thanks in advance.

Replies:

Posted By: Fatmangolf
Date Posted: 24 Jan 2023 at 8:06am

Welcome aboard James. I have a similar sized room and bought a REL sub in the 1990's. Very good sub. It filled in the lowest frequencies well when I had stand mount speakers but less so when I got larger speakers with extended response. The PMC speakers I have heard had deep bass as well as the detail. In a square room of that size the acoustics are challenging as I know from years of moving and measuring the acoustics. You may find moving the 22's nearer the back wall gives some more bass extension without the hassle of a sub.

On the phono preamp I think you will be pleasantly surprised at the improvement an Accession will bring to your listening. I suggest borrowing one from the loan scheme.

-------------
Jon

Open mind and ears whilst owning GSP Genera, Accession M, Accession MC, Elevator EXP, Solo ULDE, Proprius amps, Cusat50 cables, Lautus digital cable, Spatia cables and links, and a Majestic DAC.

Posted By: RedRover7
Date Posted: 24 Jan 2023 at 9:22am

Thanks Jon for the reply. I think a sub might add a bit of (for lack of a better word) "presence" to the overall sound. PMC say that their own sub lifts the performance closer to the top of the range floorstaders in the range, that is the 26s. But at nearly 5 grand it's the price of an pair of pretty good floor standers in itself. Of course I am sure it's an amazing piece of kit.

Could something like a say REL T9 give me 80 or 90 percent of what the PMC does do you think ?

Posted By: Mikeh
Date Posted: 24 Jan 2023 at 12:07pm

If you are having problems with room effects, it's often said that a pair of smaller subs can help tame room modes. Maybe not go as low as a single larger sub but better for poor room acoustics. Having said that, I found integrating a pair of REL Tx5s with my little Harbeth P3s to be really difficult. I must have spent 6 months fiddling with settings using the REL instructions and not satisfied. I then opened up a rabbit hole and started measuring with REW (free) software and UMIK mic. This revealed how much the room was damaging the bass with my prefered speaker placement. A lot of measurements and researching best speaker positioning resulted in far better response, removing the worse of room effects. I now use dsp to integrate the subs but keep a 'pure GS' route to mains only. So I have the option to include subs for some music but to be honest even though the P3s now only go down to 90Hz, I usually prefer the clarity of mains only.

In your case with the PMC 22s, which are renowned for good bass response, I would have thought research of best speaker placement and maybe some room treatment would prove very worthwhile before spending on sub(s).

I would suggest your deck and cartridge deserve a trial with an Accession which offers such a sublime sound. Really amazing!

-------------
Mike

Technics sl1210g with Victor U-2
Accession MM, Majestic + Proprius, Solo ULDE
Cambridge Audio CXC CD player
Lindemann Limetree Bridge streamer
Harbeth P3ESR XD paired with 2x REL t5x

Posted By: RedRover7
Date Posted: 24 Jan 2023 at 12:54pm

Appreciate the reply Mike. Would really like to hear the Accession. As far as I know there are no local dealers near where I live and will as Jon previously suggested, try to pursue the loaner route. As for the sub I do fear it could lead to a " down a rabbit hole" scenario of constant fiddling so I will look at the options you suggest regarding alternative solutions.

Posted By: lfc jon
Date Posted: 24 Jan 2023 at 8:19pm

Hi James.

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Reflex M, Solo (both with PSU-1) CuSat50, Lautus, Spatia & Spatia links cables. Ortofon Bronze.

Posted By: RedRover7
Date Posted: 24 Jan 2023 at 8:37pm

Hi Jon, Hope all good with you.

Posted By: Fatmangolf
Date Posted: 25 Jan 2023 at 7:16am

RedRover7 wrote:

Thanks Jon for the reply. I think a sub might add a bit of (for lack of a better word) "presence" to the overall sound. PMC say that their own sub lifts the performance closer to the top of the range floorstanders in the range, that is the 26s. But at nearly 5 grand it's the price of an pair of pretty good floor standers in itself. Of course I am sure it's an amazing piece of kit.

Could something like a say REL T9 give me 80 or 90 percent of what the PMC does do you think ?

Yes I agree you can get a good sub or subs for less. I'd slso say like Mike that two subs will generally give a more even response and it is what I have done. However they are in my AV system which has room correction and are not connected to my hifi speakers. You are about the time consuming effort of trying to get it all right on positioning and settings... especially in a normal sized room!