From much-loved Bitzie to —?
Printed From: Graham Slee Hifi System Components
Category: Find what you're looking for here!
Forum Name: Buying a headphone amp, phono preamp or hi-fi accessory?
Forum Description: Find what you're looking for here! Links to our websites and more...
URL: https://www.hifisystemcomponents.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4350
Printed Date: 19 Apr 2024 at 6:47am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: From much-loved Bitzie to —?
Posted By: gbr2004uk
Subject: From much-loved Bitzie to —?
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2017 at 12:51pm
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I bought the Bitzie with associated cable (Lautus I seem to recall) in 2013 and I've been delighted with it. Recently I've gone back to serious music listening. The volume knob on the Bitzie has developed a bit of a "shuffly" sound if I turn it during listening which I guess is probably easy to fix. I guess something has got loose? I don't necessarily want or need to change it for another Slee product, but I've been looking at Headphone amps. I got a Sennheiser HD700 (I recall a controversy years ago about Sennheiser headphones but I must say I've used them in various editions for many years and have always liked them -- I love the HD700, which anyway was the max I could afford!) As I said I've been looking quickly at the Headphone amps list on this site and wondering if they'd give me any significant advantage over the Bitzie? Oh, and if I return the Bitzie for servicing (if that's still possible) how long would be the turnaround time, approx? Thanks in advance for any help with the main question re headphone amps, and meanwhile I'll keep looking through the forums. At my age (don't ask!) I do have some — I guess wearily normal — age-related hearing loss, although it doesn't affect my enjoyment of the music. My guess is that the Sennheiser might make up for any high frequency loss. (I only wear hearing aids for watching television and at meetings in halls -- though I wish audiences wouldn't clap so frequently!!) All best Brian |
Replies:
Posted By: Ash
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2017 at 2:34pm
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Is the "shuffly" sound from the Bitzie in the left channel, right channel or is it in both? Graham stands by his products and their reputation and will be willing to help resolve your problem. In my personal opinion, connecting a headphone amp like the Solo Ultra-Linear DE to the Bitzie doesn't add anything additional to the sound reproduction. Just my opinion, of course, and only for the Sennheiser headphones that I used. The Bitzie is a tremendously good headamp on its own. Just a shame its USB only. ------------- We do not see things as they are. We see things as we are. |
Posted By: gbr2004uk
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2017 at 5:11pm
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Many thanks Ash. "Shuffly" was the best, not very good, work I picked for what you can get on the volume knob of, say, a much used old radio (perhaps kept in the kitchen), it's not, I'm sure, a real problem with the inner works of the Bitzie, and sounds to me like something adventitious happening to the sound on the way out of the box to the phones! It's both channels. I could try taking a screwdriver to tighten the little screw on the volume knob without doing any damage. If I don't touch the vol. knob during play, the sound is perfect. Thanks for your comment on the Solo U-L DE amp as possible addition to the Bitzie (I realise it's your opinion, but I regard it as pretty expert!). I used to experiment a lot with the Foobar2000 a few years ago but the only thing I've added now that I've gone back to it is the Dolby Headphone wrapper. Has foobar2000 changed its appearance? I seem to remember when you went to Preferences, there was more of a "double spread" look to the page, and you could bring various things from one side (column) to the business side, adding it to what foobar actually played -- I don't seem to be able to bring that column up any more. I must be missing something. |
Posted By: Ash
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2017 at 6:51pm
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My current Bitzie was almost new when I bought it second hand. The volume dial was a little scratchy (mechanically, not electronically!) around about the 12 o'clock position when I first used it. After a few turns, the slight scratchy sound vanished completely so it just needed physically settling in. A Bitzie I owned in the past had an occasional "shuffly" sound in the left channel only and only when I moved the volume dial. It was inconsistent and I was never able to ascertain the exact cause. May have been a small issue with a volume pot batch perhaps as the Bitzie is NOT faulty electronically (I'm not bashing it and my current Bitzie does not have the issue). It's one of Graham Slee's best products in my opinion as the price to performance ratio is really astounding. I'm no expert  ; I'm a sensible listener and have some experience, that's all. The simplest signal path is often the one that sounds the best. To improve on the Bitzie with standard Lautus bus-powered cable, I think a Lautus powerwire with a high quality 5V power supply would probably be more beneficial for the music than adding another Lautus cable to a PSU1-powered Solo headamp. This is my reasoning because the Bitzie is limited by the quality of its power supply, not the quantity. There is more than enough power available for driving most headphones to high enough volumes. It is that bus-power from a computer will introduce anomalies/distortions in the signal being transferred. (My opinion)------------- We do not see things as they are. We see things as we are. |
Posted By: gbr2004uk
Date Posted: 12 Feb 2018 at 2:26pm
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Hi again -- I'd forgotten this exchange and glad I've just found it again. I'm getting the Solo ULDE on trial. I need to check if I need a special cable to connect it up with the Bitzie. (It might come with the trial package?) A number of people have told me it will make a big difference to the sound, for the good. But if not, I'll get back to you because not being a techie I didn't understand what you said about the Lautus powerwire (my Bitzie is connected to the USB port on the desktop with a Lautus). All best Brian ------------- Voyager 2009, Bitzie+Lautus cable 2013, Sennheiser HD700 & 650, Yamaha Clavinova |
Posted By: gbr2004uk
Date Posted: 12 Feb 2018 at 2:49pm
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PS Just been checking out http://www.hifisystemcomponents.com/dacs-digital-audio/bitzie-usb-dac.html" rel="nofollow - https://www.hifisystemcomponents.com/dacs-digital-audio/bitzie-usb-dac.html which pretty much answers my question. Best regards Brian ------------- Voyager 2009, Bitzie+Lautus cable 2013, Sennheiser HD700 & 650, Yamaha Clavinova |
Posted By: Ash
Date Posted: 12 Feb 2018 at 10:57pm
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Adding a Lautus phono-phono dual mono cable and Solo ULDE onto the Bitzie analogue output is not guaranteed to provide any improvement. It depends on what headphones you're driving. Some models will possibly benefit from the Solo ULDE circuit configuration (e.g difficult loads such as some Grados) and some models can benefit from additional power availability (inefficient devices like the AKG K1000). Others however won't improve at all, in my opinion. The Bitzie is a tremendously good headphone amplifier. Its bus-power is the weakest link, not its output. ------------- We do not see things as they are. We see things as we are. |
Posted By: Fatmangolf
Date Posted: 13 Feb 2018 at 8:12am
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Keep the Y-adaptor (3.5mm stereo to 2 phono sockets) that came with the Bitzie. Plug this into the Bitizie output with its volume on full, run a pair of phono leads like Cusat50 to input 1 of the Solo ULDE. ------------- Jon Open mind and ears whilst owning GSP Genera, Accession M, Accession MC, Elevator EXP, Solo ULDE, Proprius amps, Cusat50 cables, Lautus digital cable, Spatia cables and links, and a Majestic DAC. |
Posted By: gbr2004uk
Date Posted: 13 Feb 2018 at 2:48pm
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Thanks Ash. "The Bitzie is a tremendously good headphone amplifier. Its bus-power is the weakest link, not its output." Agree, it has enormous power to amp my headphones. I thought I read somewhere here that it's possible to plug it into a 5V supply but maybe I misread that (anyway, I can't see where it would fit into the box). "Adding a Lautus phono-phono dual mono cable and Solo ULDE onto the Bitzie analogue output is not guaranteed to provide any improvement." The fortnight's test will reveal all (+ve and/or -ve!) I've been seening 'Grado' so much here and elsewhere I had a brief look at their website just now but stopped after seeing the top brand pair for nearly 2 Grand! Ouch! But I'll go back and take another look. I don't know that it's possible to get them sent on approval. Can any headphones really be that great!! Yeah, I guess maybe they can. Looking forward to the trial of the Solo. All best Brian Milton Keynes, UK ------------- Voyager 2009, Bitzie+Lautus cable 2013, Sennheiser HD700 & 650, Yamaha Clavinova |
Posted By: gbr2004uk
Date Posted: 13 Feb 2018 at 3:00pm
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Still looking for that Y-adaptor (I know I kept it in one of those safe places). Thanks, Jon, for the instructions, because I was going to ask what to do with the volume on the Bitzie when connected to the Solo. (I've found an old chrome-looking(?) Y-adaptor which came with some kit I got for the Clavinova years ago but it would surely disgrace a GS piece of engineering!) Best B ------------- Voyager 2009, Bitzie+Lautus cable 2013, Sennheiser HD700 & 650, Yamaha Clavinova |
Posted By: Ash
Date Posted: 13 Feb 2018 at 8:19pm
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The Bitzie receives both power and signal through the same single USB plug. However, using a product like Graham's "Powerwire" splits the plug into a power plug and signal plug. The power plug can be connected to anything that offers 5V to USB spec whilst the signal plug connects to your audio source. This allows a higher quality and lower noise power supply to be used with the Bitzie. It allows you to keep the Bitzie powered on all the time whilst not connected to a signal source, allowing the electronic circuit to reach and remain in its optimum state for music reproduction. You don't need to spend £2000 for exceptional headphone sound. Less than £1000 is needed. For that 2k price though, I think you can get much more out of speakers, if I'm completely honest. ------------- We do not see things as they are. We see things as we are. |
Posted By: Fatmangolf
Date Posted: 13 Feb 2018 at 10:09pm
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Brian I will include a Y adaptor and you can easily compare it to your chrome unit. ------------- Jon Open mind and ears whilst owning GSP Genera, Accession M, Accession MC, Elevator EXP, Solo ULDE, Proprius amps, Cusat50 cables, Lautus digital cable, Spatia cables and links, and a Majestic DAC. |
Posted By: Farmer
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2018 at 10:01am
As Ash says - you can do really well for under £1000, but it's REALLY subjective (isn't all high end audio?) It's worth noting that the Beyerdynamic T1's (v2) are now on Amazon at under £800... They're not everyone's cup of tea, but I really like them. I have quite a collection now, and the T1's are always the one's I end up using the most over my Grados, Denons, Sennheisers and Audio Technicas etc... |
gbr2004uk wrote:Posted By: gbr2004uk
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2018 at 1:16pm
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That reminds me of those stories one reads about experiments where concert violinists and others took part in "blind"-tests and failed to distinguish between Stradivarius and good modern instruments! One radio broadcast that I actually heard involved the great Isaac Stern, who maintained that about 90% of what they were hearing (in one test) was "the room". (Similar tests are on a less exalted, more homely level, involving coffee or the celebrated milk-first/tea-first controversy -- although some chemists have assured me there is a sound basis for one of them, only I can't remember which!) But seriously yes, there's a huge difference between my Sennheiser phones and the 10GBP bits of plastic I use sometimes when out in the street. Maybe when you get to the "high end" stuff the differences are much more subjective, as you suggest. And then perhaps one is into the area of diminishing returns? (Or so I like to convince myself when ruefully contemplating the limits of my budget, hmm...) It links up with something that always irritates me (and not just in the field of aesthetics): when someone says "So-and-so is the greatest [X] in the world today ..." or "This was the worst crime against humanity ever perpetrated ..." Why not simply, "One of the worst", "One of the best" etc? But I'll shut up and stop rambling now. Back to the music. Cheers Brian ------------- Voyager 2009, Bitzie+Lautus cable 2013, Sennheiser HD700 & 650, Yamaha Clavinova |
Posted By: Farmer
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2018 at 1:41pm
Probably in danger of violent agreement here!! I only bought my T1's (a big step) because the box (carrying case) was damaged and so they arrived new and perfect (apart from their case which I repaired) - at under £500. At the time when they were selling at £1400, I thought I'd done well.. I can't see me ever heading above £800-900 for anything to do with high fi, but then I'm not awash in cash... If I won the lottery - now that's a different question!!  I think above a certain level these are (inverse?) logarithmic steps, meaning you are spending more and more for smaller and smaller improvements... My own ears are not THAT good! Cheers David
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Posted By: gbr2004uk
Date Posted: 17 Feb 2018 at 12:46am
Thanks David. Actually it occurred to me (not sure if this is a good analogy) thinking about people or machines who or which get to the highest levels of creativity or performance ... There was a result from one of the current races in something or other where an athlete won by 0.11 of a second. Blink when they got to the finishing line and you missed it ...  That's only one reason why I hate competitions! Brian ------------- Voyager 2009, Bitzie+Lautus cable 2013, Sennheiser HD700 & 650, Yamaha Clavinova |
Posted By: gbr2004uk
Date Posted: 17 Feb 2018 at 1:47pm
Hi Ash, I've looked in the Shop area of the forum and can't see anything that looks like the 'Powerwire' you describe. Where can I find out more about it, please? Thanks again for all the help! Best Brian ------------- Voyager 2009, Bitzie+Lautus cable 2013, Sennheiser HD700 & 650, Yamaha Clavinova |
Posted By: gwebster
Date Posted: 17 Feb 2018 at 5:17pm
Try https://www.hifisystemcomponents.com/interconnects-cables/lautus-interconnect.html" rel="nofollow - here on the Lautus interconnect page |
Posted By: gbr2004uk
Date Posted: 17 Feb 2018 at 5:44pm
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Thanks GW! Progress report: Just playing through the new set of Bernstein recordings (the complete Naxos Recordings, with Marin Alsop) and I've found the first really clear and unambiguous difference in sound with Bitzie/Lautus alone, and with added Solo DLE. On the first disc, Symphony 1, just 4 minutes in to the end, there are very high pitch wind and then high strings, followed by a powerfully built up crescendo of the full orchestral forces, with lots of percussion including fortissimo bass drum. Without the Solo, the Bitzie does a great job but the high pitch on the Sennheiser HD700 sounds quite shrill. Plugging the Solo in quickly, reveals noticeable increase in detail and a moderation of the shrill sound (it no longer sounds shrill), together with an increase in soundstage width and depth, but above all, it's just that bit warmer. Maybe I should mention (have I already? not sure) that I do have a mild age-appropriate(!) hearing loss, and after a brief stint in a steel factory job in my younger days with very inadequate hearing protection, I get a mercifully-livable-with tinnitus, so any moderation of higher frequencies is a bonus. This Bernstein track certainly will put any headphone and amp configuration through their paces. Still testing ... All best Brian ------------- Voyager 2009, Bitzie+Lautus cable 2013, Sennheiser HD700 & 650, Yamaha Clavinova |
Posted By: Ash
Date Posted: 17 Feb 2018 at 9:47pm
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I'm glad adding the Solo has improved the abilities of your headphones. At least you can hear the difference for yourself now rather than just reading the words of someone who hasn't tried your exact scenario. The difference must be highly headphone dependent then. For my HD540 Reference II, I couldn't easily discern Bitzie from Bitzie+Solo. I quite often used to plug the HD540II into just my laptop headphone socket and still enjoy a really good clear sound because it had a very neutral and transparent sound characteristic with no shrill/harsh treble. Although adding a Bitzie and Lautus USB cable improved all of its abilities dramatically. The first time I played Nujabes-Gone Are The Days into LautusUSB-Bitzie-HD540II, I remember being absolutely blown away at how incredible the sound was. The rhythm was liquid smooth and the bass was tight and powerful, especially after the Bitzie had been powered on for at least several hours. It is a bit "cold" sounding when you first plug it in but rapidly improves over time. ------------- We do not see things as they are. We see things as we are. |