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Help with Solo SgrII
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BackinBlack View Drop Down
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Points: 1949 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BackinBlack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Nov 2022 at 12:36pm
On further reading of the manual, am I right in thinking that if you're using a Hi-Cap power supply then one of the outputs will be used as the power input from the Hi-Cap. If so only one output will be available unless you have a special lead made.

Ian
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VenetianGambler View Drop Down
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Originally posted by BackinBlack BackinBlack wrote:

On further reading of the manual, am I right in thinking that if you're using a Hi-Cap power supply then one of the outputs will be used as the power input from the Hi-Cap. If so only one output will be available unless you have a special lead made.

Ian

Yes it's something like that. It's all quite complicated I think.
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I am wondering if I'm getting somewhere though.

The difference in output between my turntable and CD player is considerable, so much so that I have attenuated plugs on my CD player so that I don't get a nasty shock when I switch inputs on my amp.

I've removed these plugs to see what the Solo would do. My hearing isn't amazing, and I favour loud listening (!) - but with the plugs removed, 12 o'clock on the Solo is now acceptable. Would this be what you would expect?

So now this means that it's potentially not the Solo, OR the naim amp that's the issue - but in fact the gain / output perhaps of the RIAA Phono boards I have in the Naim amp are the problem.
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Firstly:


75mV

The Solo SRGII sensitivity is

Input sensitivity (for specified power output) - 32 Ohms: 250mV rms; 600 Ohms: 775mV rms

For the Grado's it is 10dB low, and -10dB relates to approx. 1/10th power and 1/10th power sounds half as loud.

I could see that the output playing vinyl might be low, but not the CD, until I read that you have attenuated plugs, so that now makes sense.

Now, all things being equal, the Solo up full should sound twice as loud as at 12-noon, because the difference is 10.

So we're now on the same page.

Also note that the Solo's are made so that the volume control can be used at any position to assist in matching a number of sensitivities, unlike most integrated's and preamps where anything much higher than 1pm distorts badly.

So, by removing the attenuators you now have a healthy signal, and you can turn the Solo up as high as you want (but eventually it may clip, but by then it should be too loud anyway).

The remaining problem being insufficient gain from vinyl, and I'm afraid that's how it was in the 70s and 80s when your NAC was designed.

The DIN standard was adapted into IEC 1938 (now IEC 61938), which was first published in 1996 (that's what my copy tells me), and domestic line level, which such things are, is 245mV, and definitely not 75mV.
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VenetianGambler View Drop Down
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Points: 11 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VenetianGambler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Nov 2022 at 1:36pm
Originally posted by Graham Slee Graham Slee wrote:

Firstly:


75mV

The Solo SRGII sensitivity is

Input sensitivity (for specified power output) - 32 Ohms: 250mV rms; 600 Ohms: 775mV rms

For the Grado's it is 10dB low, and -10dB relates to approx. 1/10th power and 1/10th power sounds half as loud.

I could see that the output playing vinyl might be low, but not the CD, until I read that you have attenuated plugs, so that now makes sense.

Now, all things being equal, the Solo up full should sound twice as loud as at 12-noon, because the difference is 10.

So we're now on the same page.

Also note that the Solo's are made so that the volume control can be used at any position to assist in matching a number of sensitivities, unlike most integrated's and preamps where anything much higher than 1pm distorts badly.

So, by removing the attenuators you now have a healthy signal, and you can turn the Solo up as high as you want (but eventually it may clip, but by then it should be too loud anyway).

The remaining problem being insufficient gain from vinyl, and I'm afraid that's how it was in the 70s and 80s when your NAC was designed.

The DIN standard was adapted into IEC 1938 (now IEC 61938), which was first published in 1996 (that's what my copy tells me), and domestic line level, which such things are, is 245mV, and definitely not 75mV.

Brilliant Graham - thank you. 

Does this mean that this would likely be resolved with a different phono pre-amp?

At the moment, I've got Naim phono boards in the NAC which are presumably of a similar vintage - and like you said, have 70s-80s style gain.

Would getting one of your own phono amps, and running it into a different source input on the NAC create a bit more equilibrium between the CD and vinyl? 


Edited by VenetianGambler - 07 Nov 2022 at 1:41pm
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Graham Slee View Drop Down
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Points: 15005 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Graham Slee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Nov 2022 at 1:57pm
Originally posted by VenetianGambler VenetianGambler wrote:

Would getting one of your own phono amps, and running it into a different source input on the NAC create a bit more equilibrium between the CD and vinyl? 

Erm yes, but I didn't want to sound like a salesman taking advantage of your situation.

As you're nearby, the guy you were talking to this morning (John) can assist you, and will let you borrow any of the stages we do, and then before risking any money changing hands, you can satisfy yourself by using it with the NAC. It shouldn't cause any problems as the voltage rail in the NAC should be high enough so as not to clip with either the CD player without attenuators, or phono stage, but it's best to try it first.

Then, if it does work, this topic acts as a record to assist others who may have a similar problem. Wink
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VenetianGambler View Drop Down
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Points: 11 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VenetianGambler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Nov 2022 at 2:00pm
Originally posted by Graham Slee Graham Slee wrote:

Originally posted by VenetianGambler VenetianGambler wrote:

Would getting one of your own phono amps, and running it into a different source input on the NAC create a bit more equilibrium between the CD and vinyl? 

Erm yes, but I didn't want to sound like a salesman taking advantage of your situation.

As you're nearby, the guy you were talking to this morning (John) can assist you, and will let you borrow any of the stages we do, and then before risking any money changing hands, you can satisfy yourself by using it with the NAC. It shouldn't cause any problems as the voltage rail in the NAC should be high enough so as not to clip with either the CD player without attenuators, or phono stage, but it's best to try it first.

Then, if it does work, this topic acts as a record to assist others who may have a similar problem. Wink



Again, that's brilliant Graham - and no sense of you taking advantage from here. 

I will be in touch with John.
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