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So which turntable?

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patientot View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patientot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Apr 2021 at 8:21pm
Originally posted by lfc jon lfc jon wrote:

As Pro-j--t only started manufacturing turntables in around 1991 why did they not look into DD motors, it must be down to cost of R&D and when look at the price of a Technics turntable even the cheapest one they make is not what you call a budget turntable, Now I know you will say we are talking high end here but is it also what Kevin said it's easier to make belt drive and less cost as the technology is out there.
what other high end turntable manufacture is using DD? there must be a reason for this, and cost does not come into it when you are looking at turntables with a price of a house or a luxury car. Goldmund Reference ll cost £165000 and that is belt drive another one AV Designhaus Derenvilla £460000 also belt drive why are these not DD?


Small companies do not have the R&D or manufacturing economies of scale to make a DD deck, usually. If they are making one, they have to source the motor from a third party usually, and then charge $$$ for their final product. It's why a VPI DD deck costs $15-30K and their belt drives are much less than that, and they mostly sell belt drives.

Even one of the most expensive tonearm companies in the world (SAT out of Sweden) could not figure out how to make their own DD motor for their turntable. They basically take a Technics model, then harvest the motor and motor control system for their own turntable.

Most of the motors used in belt drive turntables are off the shelf industrial motors. Many of them are fairly cheap. VPI uses a $28 motor on one of their $6K BD turntables. Companies like Rega and P******t, that purchase massive bulk quantities of Premontec/Allied Motion/etc. motors, are able to get the per piece cost down even cheaper than that.
SL-1200 MK7 (modified) + Reflex M + PSU-1 used with AT150-40ML, AT VM95ML, Stanton 680mkII + Ogura, and Shure M35X cartridges.
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lfc jon View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lfc jon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Apr 2021 at 4:49pm
As Pro-j--t only started manufacturing turntables in around 1991 why did they not look into DD motors, it must be down to cost of R&D and when look at the price of a Technics turntable even the cheapest one they make is not what you call a budget turntable, Now I know you will say we are talking high end here but is it also what Kevin said it's easier to make belt drive and less cost as the technology is out there.
what other high end turntable manufacture is using DD? there must be a reason for this, and cost does not come into it when you are looking at turntables with a price of a house or a luxury car. Goldmund Reference ll cost £165000 and that is belt drive another one AV Designhaus Derenvilla £460000 also belt drive why are these not DD?
Reflex M, Solo (both with PSU-1) CuSat50, Lautus, Spatia & Spatia links cables. Ortofon Bronze.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CageyH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Apr 2021 at 3:11pm
Why would they want to invest in an alternative drive arrangement when the product line is based around the same technology. It is easier to carry on milking the cash cow, that is their belt drive system.

As well as R&D costs, the manufacturing cost will be higher, so I guess they see no financial interest in it.
Kevin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fatmangolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 2021 at 9:59pm
A good point and interesting question Rich. And if I didn't have a Michell Gorbe with SME IV arm and a 1210/II I would be tempted to buy a 1200G.

Jon

Open mind and ears whilst owning GSP Genera, Accession M, Accession MC, Elevator EXP, Solo ULDE, Proprius amps, Cusat50 cables, Lautus digital cable, Spatia cables and links, and a Majestic DAC.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RichW Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 2021 at 1:22pm
It would, or would have been, very interesting to see a turntable manufacturer with long experience and resource such as L*nn or Rega investigating alternative drive systems to the ubiquitous belt.
It might be claimed that the costs to develop a DD motor or rim drive are prohibitive but there may also be historical reasons.





Edited by RichW - 29 Apr 2021 at 4:14pm
Majestic/Enigma, Accession MM & MC.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Old skool Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2021 at 7:31am
I have had highly modded Rega’s, still have a £5k LP12. 

However if I had my time again I’d save a lot of wasted time & expense by going straight for a Technics 1200G. 

By far the best turntable under £10000.  Yes it looks like a DJ deck.  Knocks 401’s & LP12’s into a cocked hat. 
No fettling, servicing or upgrading required. 

Just perfect information retrieval every single time. 

Please try one before you waste your time & money like I did!




Edited by Old skool - 26 Apr 2021 at 7:32am
Is the pursuit High Fidelity a sign of mental illness??
I think so....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ajmvet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Mar 2021 at 7:07pm
A little late to the parade, but Origin Live allow a 60 day demo of all their products.
Whichever TT you go for, demo the Zephyr with the silver wire upgrade.
It will make you sit up and take notice!
I am running mine on a modified P3 and it's simply stunning!
Each to their own though.
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